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CBS News Sunday Morning October 26, 2025 9:18:42 a.m. Eastern JANE PAULEY: California’s Governor, Gavin Newsom, has been serving in elective office for more than two decades now. But perhaps his most visible role these days is as one of the Trump administration’s most persistent critics. He’s talking with our Robert Costa. GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D-CA): Got hundreds and hundreds. ICE and Border Patrol. Don’t think for a second we’re not gonna be seeing more of that through Election Day. These guys are not screwing around. ROBERT COSTA: This past week, California Governor Gavin Newsom was on the campaign trail, not running for office but stumping for a state ballot measure that has attracted national attention, Proposition 50. NEWSOM: — the future’s inside of every single one of you. COSTA: If it succeeds next week, Democrats will change the boundaries of U.S. House districts in California and make it easier for their party to win more seats. NEWSOM [on “Yes on 50” advertisement]: We can’t stand back and watch this democracy disappear district by district all across this country. We’re giving the power to the people. COSTA: Newsom says Prop 50 is a direct response to President Trump’s redistricting push in Republican-controlled states like Texas. WOMAN [on 08/04/25]: The new map would give the GOP an advantage and at least five more seats. COSTA: On one level, Proposition 50 is about Congressional maps. But you’re framing it as something bigger. NEWSOM: Yeah, I mean, I think it’s about our democracy. It’s about the future of this republic. I think it’s about, you know, what the founding fathers lived and died for, this notion of the rule of law, not the rule of Don, this notion of popular sovereignty, fundamentally, a co-equal branches of government, system of checks and balances. His Presidency de facto ends next November. If we’re successful, we the people are successful in taking back the House and making sure that we’re successful — COSTA: You really believe, Governor, if the Democrats take back power in the House, his Presidency’s over? NEWSOM: De facto as we know it today. Fire and fury signifying maybe something. But finally, you have rebalanced this system. Co-equal branch of government begins to assert itself, it appears again. If you have a Speaker Johnson, we may have a third term of President Trump. I really believe that. COSTA: Newsom, 58, has emerged as one of Trump’s leading antagonists at a time when the President is wielding executive power across the board and facing little pushback from Republicans in Congress. [Cuts to clip] NEWSOM [on 06/10/25]: We do not want our streets militarized by our own armed forces. Not in L.A., not in California, not anywhere. COSTA: Newsom has fought Trump’s deployment of the National Guard in California. And just minutes before we sat down on Thursday, the President had pulled back from a threat to send federal agents to the streets of San Francisco, where Newsom once served as mayor. COSTA: What’s it like being the Governor of the state of California and not knowing day to day if the federal government’s going to be sending agents or not to your state? NEWSOM: Yeah, I mean, it’s a — it — hell of a way to govern. I mean, we’re just governing in just profound uncertainty. The sort of tectonic plates that we’re familiar with out here on the West Coast, but of our — the nature of our politics. Some may find this, you know, may not be a — a sort of prudent thing to say about — COSTA: Let’s hear it. NEWSOM: — the President of the United States. But, I mean, he’s an invasive species. COSTA: For California? NEWSOM: For the country. For the world. He’s a wrecking ball, not just the symbolism and substance of the East Wing. He’s wrecking alliances, truth, trust, tradition, institutions. COSTA: What do you say to Republicans, Governor, and critics of California who say California needs ICE? You’ve heard that refrain from all of them. NEWSOM: California cooperates as it relates to criminals. We continue to cooperate out of our state penitentiary system, hundreds of people every month that we coordinate with ICE to go after the worst of the worst. That’s not what this is about. And everybody knows it. You don’t just randomly show up at a car wash and tell me it’s about the worst of the worst. You don’t randomly show up at the showrooms or the parking lots of every Home Depot. [Cuts to clip] PRES. DONALD TRUMP [on 06/09/25]: He’s destroying one of our great states and — COSTA: Newsom’s critique hasn’t stopped Trump from stepping in or hitting back. This past summer, Trump suggested Newsom should be arrested for how he’s led California. And this past week, the Justice Department said it would send election monitors to keep an eye on the Prop 50 vote. Newsom has called it intimidation. Yet Newsom isn’t only countering Trump. He’s also trying to understand his movement. That includes bringing the President’s allies onto his podcast, such as the late Charlie Kirk. [Cuts to clip] NEWSOM [on This is Gavin Newsom, 03/06/25]: Because I think people need to understand your success, your influence. COSTA: You’ve spoken about how your son has told you to pay attention to some of these voices out there. NEWSOM: Well, we didn’t pay attention. I mean, we — we’ve got a crisis in this country besides the crisis that we’ve discussed around the future of this republic. But we also have a crisis of — with masculinity and men. Men are struggling, and multi-ethnic. I mean, suicide rates are off the charts, dropout rates, suspension rates, loneliness, despair, deaths of despair. It’s a serious crisis that’s going on in this country. Democrats haven’t focused on that issue, and I’m very proud of the work or substantive work we’re doing in this. But I’ve also been using the podcast to highlight that. COSTA: Podcasts are just part of Newsom’s attempt to get some traction in our so-called attention economy. Another has been satire. Newsom’s team has parodied Trump’s use of social media, mocking the President’s use of capital letters and AI-generated art. NEWSOM: Thank you, guys. Thank you. COSTA: But Newsom has not abandoned old-fashioned politics. This past July, we spent a day following him across South Carolina, which just happens to be a key state in the 2028 Presidential race. NEWSOM: Donald Trump, if we do this right, within 18 months, de facto will no longer be President of the United States. He will be muted — COSTA: You’re not afraid to go into red states. NEWSOM: No. COSTA: When I saw you slinging shots behind the coffee bar, I thought, this guy might run for President. NEWSOM: I have no idea. The idea that a guy who got a 960 on his SAT, that still struggles to read scripts, that was always in the back of the classroom, the idea that you even throw that out is in and of itself extraordinary. Who the hell knows? I’m looking forward to who presents themselves in 2028 and who meets that moment. And that’s the question for the American people. They’ll make that determination. COSTA: Is it fair to say, after the 2026 midterms, you’re going to give it serious thought? NEWSOM: Yeah, I’d be lying otherwise. I’d just be lying, and I can’t do that. COSTA: Governor, you have long said that if you ever run for the White House, you need a compelling why — NEWSOM: Yeah. COSTA: —a reason. Are you moving closer to figuring out your own why and your own decision? NEWSOM: Yeah. And Nietzsche said, “If you have a compelling why, you can endure any how.” And so I don’t think — you know, I think the biggest challenge for anyone who runs for any office is people see right through you if you don’t have that why. You’re doing it for the wrong reasons. And so, look, well, that will — that faith will determine that. COSTA: You certainly seem to like being on the ground in South Carolina. I have to say that. Seeing you up close, you were having a good time. NEWSOM: I happen to, and thank God I’m in the right business. I love people. I actually love people.
